We discuss in this interview:

• Dianne’s journey from diagnosis to pain-free and drug-free after 2 years using the Paddison Program
• The support she has received from her rheumatologist throughout the process
• The importance of having a vision as an end goal
• Conflicting voices in our head
• Biologic drugs and remission
• 10 steps to remission
• Astonishing effects of ocean swimming
• Non-counterproductive drugs
• Strength and inflammation
• Patience in pursuing a goal

Clint – Today, my beautiful people, we are about to meet Dianne. And Dianne is the most perfect student of what I recommend I think that I’ve ever had on the show. She’s going to tell you in just a moment a sort of short snapshot of what she’s been able to do in the last couple of years. And what we’re going to talk about in this episode is how she has followed the exact path from diagnosis to where she is today and all of the correct things that she’s done. I don’t know if we’ll find too many things that she’s done wrong, so this is an ideal episode. If you are looking at the ideal way to do things, especially if you’re newly diagnosed and you’ll definitely learn stuff as well. Even if you’ve had RA Or Inflammatory arthritis for a very long time. So, Dianne, thank you for joining us all the way from Perth. How are you?

Dianne – Oh, I’m fabulous. And it’s so great to be here. Thanks, Clint.

Clint – So, Dianne, give us that snapshot of the before and after situation for you.

Dianne’s Snapshot Of Success

Dianne – Ok, so I was diagnosed on October 2019, finally, after many considerations about what was wrong with me, but finally diagnosed in October 2019 with rheumatoid arthritis. And obviously, I just went off to my rheumatologist and did what I was told and went to the rheumatologist and she said, right, you have it. So this is the plan for you and she started me on the methotrexate, etc., and so I did that. And three months later, at Christmas time, I was looking for a diet and I found the Paddison Program that I had been on the methotrexate for three months. Started the program on the 1st of January 2019 and then 20 months later, I’m fully of methotrexate. We’re now three months where I had no methotrexate, no drugs, and totally symptom-free and no inflammation whatsoever in my body.

Clint – Hmmm, well, congratulations on a result that most medical professionals would agree would be impossible. They do not see this and I’d be curious to find out what your rheumatologist has said about your results if you’ve been back to see her in the past little while.

Dianne – Yeah, she was supportive of me reducing the methotrexate because I was slowly reducing over a period of time. But when I got down to 10 milligrams, which is half, so we started on 20 milligrams, that she was starting to get a bit concerned. And I said, I’m checking my blood, you’re checking my blood and if there are any symptoms, I’m not going to be silly about this. I will always do take your guidance, but all was good, and then I reduce down to five milligrams. And then I’ve visited her because at that stage my appointments were quite a few months apart. And she said to me, there’s absolutely no point in you taking five milligrams, that’s just placebo and she said to stop it. She also said, if you don’t want to do it, just stop it. And I was quite nervous, but I thought, ok, I’ll stop it and nothing happened so I was all good. Here we are, three months down the track and she said, don’t come back and see me just to tell me you’re doing well. If you’re doing well, that’s wonderful and good on you, if you enjoy eating this way good on you. Don’t come and see me unless you need me.

Clint – Yes, it’s funny that they put that slant of strangeness onto the diet. Like if you enjoy eating this way, almost as if like if you’re crazy enough to do that, then even though the way in which you’re eating is the most compatible with the human digestive system.

Dianne – Yeah. But she’s vegetarian and she is probably a little more (Inaudible) exactly.

Clint – Yeah. Oh good, now I love it. Well okay. So fantastic. You know I always look for someone once, once in, what is this eight years I’ve been doing this. I’m just waiting for someone to say and you know what my rheumatologist said, I’m going to organize a meeting now. And what we’re going to do is we’re going to get all of my patients together in a huge theater. Right, COVID safe will set everyone aside by every second seat. And one I want to do is bring you in. And I want you to give a presentation to every patient I’ve ever had and show them what you’re doing. And then I want you to bring that printout called the Guide for Rheumatologists that ClinT has had on his website for years, where it shows all the science that supports what you’re doing. So it’s not a fluke, it matches the science. And I want you to tell them all and then let’s convince everyone to do this and see if everyone can feel tremendously better.

Dianne – I know I agree with you, because when I left the rooms, you see the patients sitting there and I want to look at them and say, hey, there is another way but I didn’t, I just left.

The Right Mindset

Clint – Now, something that has enabled you to get this kind of result is your professional skill set as well. You are a leadership coach and you have the mindset absolutely nailed both intuitively and also from an educational viewpoint. You teach this you explained to me prior to our recording that this is your profession. So in a moment, I want us to go through the mindset that you applied to yourself on this, why you feel that that was crucial to your outcome, where you’ve gotten today, and maybe even give us some tips as to what other people could do if they’re struggling with the mind game. So can we talk about that for a little bit?

Dianne – All right. My life lessons so far had taught me that if you apply yourself, if you have a vision in mind, the end goal. And you need to don’t lose sight of the end goal. That even if you waver a little bit, that you’re still heading in the right direction. I know that that works, I’ve proven it to myself before and I’ve seen it with my clients as well, is not to lose sight of what you are there for and what you’re trying to achieve. So for me, it gave me a sense of a feeling of control over my own destiny and yes, you need the support, you need the doctors and I had to see you in the program there to support. But I just followed that, so when you said do that first 12 days and then slowly introduce foods and etc. I just feel that if you follow it and as much as at times you’re hungry or you don’t like the food or whatever, you’re in no time that 12 days is over. And then in no time, three months is over and in no time six months is over. It’s like I’m on a mission and I just know it’s going to take time, it’s not a quick process. Getting RA didn’t happen overnight, that my healing wasn’t going to happen overnight. And to just be kind to myself on that journey, but never lose sight of what I’m trying to achieve here. And how exhilarating it would be to be sitting there in front of Clint, having this interview when I’m healed. I visualize that and here it is, you know, just under two years later, I’m here. So it does happen and mine wasn’t a quick journey. You see people that you’ve interviewed before that do it in one year or even less, mine wasn’t quick, but I never gave up. But I did what I knew intuitively was right after I got off the 12 days and slowly introduced all my food. So that’s the message in itself, it is just don’t lose sight of the end goal.

Dianne – We all have two voices in our head, one that says, oh, this is too hard. What are you thinking, you know, you deserve to be able to go out and have a drink. You deserve to go out and have that chocolate cake, you deserve it because it’s your birthday, you deserve it’s Christmas or you know, what about my friends? I feel ostracized from my friend’s that voice that says, but you know that voice that’s saying all the reasons why it’s difficult to stick with this program or the other voice that says you can do this? Other people have done it, you can achieve it as well. Well, be kind to yourself, support yourself, and that voice that backs you up and says you’ve got it in you, you’ve got it, and you can do it. And if you can’t have that chocolate cake, you can go and find something that’s suitable for you, that you do love, that you can eat instead. So the voice that’s saying, what options do I have? You have, choices you don’t have to give it all up, you have choices on those choices that are going to support you, save you, and get you to your end goal. Because the person you become when you get there is a bigger, better, and more inspiring person, not just that you need to inspire anybody else, you’re more inspired by yourself because of your own behavior. So it’s who you become and that journey is the end goal, really.

Clint – Yeah, I’m just making a couple of notes, hence my slowness to respond to you. I love it. It just so relates to the same kind of mindset and same kind of thought patterns that I, you know, have always held as well. You know, I would visualize the feeling of the wind in my face imagining myself running again. You know, I would picture being at a hospital, being able to to have children because I was it was very much my sort of like maximum fertility years when I was on methotrexate and, you know, newly engaged. And it was all in our mind is, are we ever going to be able to have kids? Because in Australia as you may have become aware that if you want to get onto a biologic drug, which was the next direction for me, you have to actually keep the methotrexate in the mix. You can’t because it’s subsidized by the government. And so they won’t take you up because, you know, the studies indicate that the biologic drugs tend to work better with the disease-modifying drug.

Visualize The Outcome You Want

Clint – And anyway, the point is always visualizing outcomes that at the time were really, really ambitious, but picturing them and as you said, you said don’t lose sight of the end goal. And so picturing and visualizing clearly something that that you were using a lot and made to the voices in the head. I loved that strategy as well. You know, we all have this inner dialogue. Sometimes it’s like a monkey mind, isn’t it? That just goes everywhere and in one moment, we feel like we’re crushing it. The next we feel deflated because we bump our finger on the door and it’s still inflamed and we’re like, oh, I’m losing. This sucks, I can’t do it, you know, whatever and then the new you and the better you. I always like thinking about how when we achieve something against rheumatoid we really have overcome one of the greatest foes that we will ever face. And if we can achieve a good significant outcome, whatever that means for each individual, but if it’s something over and above what the average person is expected to achieve with this disease, and we can feel so happy about who we are as a person against all odds. And that empowers us to not be so concerned about something else in life that other people are upset about. Everything’s relative, right? Someone worries because their kid came second in the sports carnival. I mean, get a grip, get a grip for someone else who just managed to swim another lap at the pool, even though they’ve got pains in their body and that is awesome.

Dianne – I really felt I was devastated when I got the diagnosis because I studied about rheumatoid. Previously, I had a client way back in a different industry that had rheumatoid really badly. So I knew how devastating some of the symptoms and the effects of it were. So when I was diagnosed, I was really, as I’m sure anyone who gets the diagnosis does flawed. But where I’m going with that. It is that it gave me a sense of control rather than just being at the whim of and doing is the doctors. Obviously, they are there and they are professionals and they give you guidance. Then it was just us doing what they told me, whereas when I started this diet for myself, it gave me some sense of control that, I have a bit of control over this too. And inevitably I had full control over it and have it done. So that’s what I found was wonderful that they say there’s no cure for rheumatoid. But, you know, I have no symptoms, you have no symptoms. So this diet to me is like pure and it’s just such a wonderful sense of being in control of my own life, my own body.

Complete Confidence & Control

Clint – Complete confidence and control is the end game, that is what we’re aiming for, and we’re not aiming for the phrase of remission, even though that’s the clinical goal. And the reason we’re not aiming for that is because you can achieve remission on a biological drug. By the definition medically of remission is you’re not showing any symptoms and your blood tests are normal. But if you can achieve that on a biologic drug for our audience, a lot of them, that’s really not the ultimate goal because they may not feel comfortable with some of the side effects of the drugs or they might just want a little bit. They might want to try and reduce the drug or I don’t know. But the ultimate goal is complete confidence and control so that what we’re doing produces predictable outcomes. And when I was first diagnosed, there was nothing predictable about it except that I was getting worse in an extremely fast manner. And that obviously was just terrifying. So, yeah, the control thing, that’s why we do a two day cleanse at the start of the program. It’s not because two days of cleansing actually really therapeutically does much at all. You don’t really feel like you got in two days of fasting. You don’t really eliminate waste and toxins and create a way better environment in your digestive tract from two days of cleansing. The main thing is, guys, do this and watch what happens. And when you feel better after two days, now you trust me. Now you see what I’m going on about and hopefully, you also have a euphoric epiphany. Wow, I have some control over this and then we say, okay, now let’s also be realistic we can’t fast forever. But you’ve got a taste of what it feels like to influence your condition, dietarily and that’s amazing.

Dianne – Yes, that is amazing.

Clint – Yeah. And that’s why it’s there it’s also there is as a differentiator between the majority who do get rid of symptoms within the two day period and those who don’t. And we go into that a lot more in the program as to what to do if you don’t. But we’re digressing if we’re going any further into that. The bottom line is, control feels so empowering and just lifts you. Right. I want to talk about three things that I’ve got on my agenda next to talk about. First of all, I want to talk about how you’re going to come on and give us some strategies and speak to our Rheumatoid Support group soon as a guest. And we’ve got to work out the details of that, whether or not you get a little course for us. So you’ll do be one of our guests and come on and do a one-hour session for our group. But definitely, you’ll be in Rheumatoid Support soon, helping us out early in the New Year, 2021 that’s one. Number two, I’m going to list all of the perfect things that you did to get to where you are now. And number three, I want to talk about swimming. We’re going to talk about the way that you exercise Bikram yoga and so forth. So I might save all of the wonderful summary of how you did this perfectly after we hear about your exercise and so forth. Tell us or walk us through the parallel efforts you made on the exercise front whilst you are also doing the diet.

Exercising As Much As We Can

Dianne – Sure, I love exercise, though I’d always exercise throughout my life, and that was really one of the indicators that there was some problems because I kept getting inflammation easily. I was injuring myself easily and I kept going to the doctor saying, you know, what’s happening? And that’s where you’re getting old you know the rest of it, you’ve got to expect this. But for someone who hadn’t kept it quite a lot, it was quite frustrating. I was adjusting my exercise along the way, so I had been doing normal yoga. But then when you would begin to Bikram, which I had tried a couple of times and just passed out before I had rheumatoid, then I thought, okay, I’m going to give this a go, so off I went. And it made sense to me to hate and to be able to really get your blood rushing through the small joints in your body really make sense. So I joined up at the local gym at the local Bikram yoga. And yeah, I did it as much as I could, which would be at least three times a week, if not four times a week. Doing it every day with just a bit too much for me. And I was walking at the same time, so on those days, during Bikram, I was walking. And that’s pretty well there for a while, and then I think it was summer here and I wanted to be outdoors more. And I also changed my exercise around a bit and my husband said to me, you know, get back in the pool. Actually, a lot of people have been saying that, too. It’s a great exercise to do as you get older because there’s no pressure on any of your joints. But I’d had bursitis in both shoulders from the gym. So, you know, I thought, oh, can I swim? Because I used to swim in high school, but eventually I got in the pool and I only did say six laps to start. And because I didn’t want to push myself and then I did that for a week. Then I did eight, I did 10, I did 14 and now I’m doing 20 laps or 1 km in the pool. And I can do that easily now, and my shoulders are great, I feel good and I feel wonderful. But I’ve gone right through winter as well when it’s freezing cold, but the pool that I go to is a little bit heated. You feel so alive when you get out of that pool. I just, it’s just one of the best exercises and I wish I got back into it sooner. So that’s my main exercise these days I still do some yoga. Actually, I started doing some Bikram just at home, I occasionally go down to the local Bikram and do that because I just love it. I do some normal yoga, I swim and I do some walking as well.

Clint – Absolutely brilliant. I’ve made time, I just love listening to you do all the things that I always say, do this, do this, and do this. And you’re just like a checklist of all the things to do.

Dianne – Yeah, I think on that Clint, there’s something that you do when you wake up in the morning and realize this and I say to myself, what exercise do I feel like doing today? Whereas I’ve talked to people who don’t exercise and they would say. I don’t feel like exercising tonight, so that’s the two voices in your head, one saying, what do I feel like? I may not feel like doing swimming in the pool, but I might feel like a nice walk along the beach, you know? So that’s my question to myself. What is it I feel like doing today? And then I go and do that.

Dianne’s Scorecard

Clint – Wow, Dianne, that’s just so good to hear all those awesome things that you’re doing with your exercise there. From the notes that I’ve taken from chatting with you today and repeat back to the perfect scorecard that you’ve gotten. And why I believe each of these things has contributed to the total result that you now have, which is a C reactive protein of less than one of all medications and no symptoms. And why I think that you’ve done so many things well, and let me list these things. First of all, when you were diagnosed, you went straight onto drugs. So a mistake that I made was waiting over a year before I started a disease-modifying drug. In my first meeting with my rheumatologist, he said, you’ve got very aggressive arthritis and it’s already spreading quickly and I recommend methotrexate. If I could wind back the clock, I should have went on to the methotrexate. You did tick the box, tick number one okay, well done.

Clint – Okay, tick number two is that it was a non-counterproductive drug. It wasn’t prednisone, you didn’t go on painkillers to see if you could tie this over for a period of time, and you didn’t take antibiotics in parallel with the methotrexate like I did. Your drug was non-counterproductive to the natural efforts that you then went and started very soon afterwards. So that’s a big tick, drug choice was the correct or a good one.

Clint – Number three was that you did the Paddison program in parallel, so you immediately got the second barrel of the double-barreled shotgun and you started firing that as well. So if you were doing the two most effective, most powerful ways to reduce inflammation at the same time that the sensible drug and the scientifically supported dietary intervention, the best possible approach, so big tick there. And then number four is that you, as you said, you just followed it exactly, you didn’t try and reinvent the wheel. Some people then say, oh, but what about oxylights? But what about raw foods versus cooked foods? And what about this? And isn’t buckwheat a grain? And what about this? And before they know it, they’ve confused themselves so much rather than just following a sequence that has worked for now over 11,000 people who follow this program. I’m not saying that we don’t have to make some of our own modifications. But why not at least just push it through, see how we go first before we immediately start googling every aspect and rethinking every part of it? Because what you’ve done is becoming an excellent student and you’ve just said, okay, this is work for those hundreds of people who are on this podcast. Why not just follow it as a student and a big tick, you’ve just said, okay, I’m going for it, let’s do it and see how we’ve got.

Dianne – Let me just add into that, you are the researcher and so I’m trusting you. You know you did the research and I could not possibly do that.

Clint – Well, that’s right. So on one hand, I’m like, absolutely, it comes from science, the origin of this as well. We’ve covered this a lot in the past, in other episodes and where it’s come from and gastroenterologists supported for optimal health and all of that, plus the science plus the all the people who succeed on it. And yes, I will just say, however, sometimes we need to, you know, the occasional person, our sweet potato just gives me a little bit of the whatever. OK, so then after a week or two, maybe switch it out, but at least go in with a positive mindset.

Clint – OK, and then so this ties into number five, which is focused on what mattered, you focused on the diet and the exercise. You’re not obsessed with, what about fish oil? What about glucosamine sulfate? I’m taking these specialist herbs, do these herbs matter? How much are these probiotics should I take? Should I eat this? You should eat this as well and blah, blah, blah, I’m also taking. These things don’t matter as much as eat the right food and exercise. I know that sounds so simple, but that’s what you focused on. You focused on the big pillars of success.

Clint – Ok, number six, what I’ve written here is bursitis gone, strength defeats inflammation. OK, so a lot of people outside of our community would if they had the sore shoulders, they were thought, I know I don’t want to go for a swim or it’s too frightening. We know our community strength defeats inflammation. So if we can build our back muscles, our lat’s, our triceps, and of course the shoulders as we swim. And that enables the support around the joint and therefore inflammation goes down. Plus the natural movement throughout the joint also lubricates it and squashes synovial fluids into the joint, therefore clearing out inflammation. So you’ve approached that so intelligently and with a leap of faith, and gotten in the pool. I’m going to add a six b, six Part B, and the six Part B is you’ve made exercise a must. No one wants to go out into the cold water and go for a swim, nobody. But you’ve said with your vision because you’ve focused on the end goal, you’ve said I’ve got a purpose behind this. The why is huge, the why is because I have a vision of the future of where I’m going, and that’s why I’m getting in the freezing cold water to swim with bursitis-ridden shoulders, right? And here we can enjoy this conversation together having the conversation you visualize because you made those choices every day,so massive kudos to you.

Clint – Number seven you’ve chosen the right exercises, again not reinventing the wheel. Bikram yoga comes up over and over again. How would we be sitting here if you hadn’t done that? No one knows, but I imagine it’s played its part. Swimming, I love swimming and I think it’s one of the most effective strategies, especially for finger pain reduction and just revitalization. I’ve been swimming in the outdoor ocean fed water salt pool down by the beach here. And like you, I’m only up to eight laps. So I started out, you know, when I started swimming, I couldn’t even swim one lap without wanting to take a little break and have a breath. Now I’m doing eight laps and you’ve inspired me. I’m going to aim for one kilometer. Okay. So thank you. And so those two together is so powerful. And one thing that I want to mention, I did briefly tell you this before we started this call. And this will be really interesting to our audience. Is there something about swimming? Is there something about getting into the ocean, especially?

Clint – And Dianne, I mentioned to you just before we started here, my neighbor, who I just met through them purchasing the house next door to us used to be on methotrexate for ankylosing spondylitis. He hasn’t had any symptoms for the last seven years. He’s not on methotrexate and he’s like it just went away. Now I consider ankylosing spondylitis, psoriasis, and rheumatoid and these things all to be under the same underlying cause. So I don’t see him as having something different, just a different location in his body that was inflamed and degrading. He took up swimming and surfing passionately and he said he goes nearly every day, he goes surfing or swimming early every day and he has no symptoms. He drinks red wine I watched him the other week and he doesn’t necessarily have the healthiest diet. But there he is and he’s not seeing a rheumatologist anymore. And then I have a relative who I actually went and saw when I got first diagnosed with R.A. because he had juvenile idiopathic arthritis in his late teenage years, that also completely went away. And he’s been pain-free without any symptoms for the rest of his life. Now to his late fifties or sixties. Well, and what he (Inaudible) or what he puts it down to is he became a surf lifesaver. So he took that up to try and get active and he lived near the water. So he started to engage and get back into being physical. And all these symptoms have been nonexistent ever since he was seventeen, eighteen years old. And I just think that is something in that.

Dianne – Yeah. There’s something remarkable about the ocean is and then the healing (inaudible) of it. But you know, what is that they focused on the enjoyment of being sea saltwater.

Clint – Clint Ober has got a book called Earthing, and we’ll get him on as a guest one day. I have not invited him, but I want to have him on a big topic that doesn’t do justice just to bring it up in passing like this. But there is an earthing nature of water being barefoot where we collect electrons from the earth and it helps to decrease oxidative stress in the body. So there is science behind this and I believe that there’s so much going on when you’re swimming in and being in the ocean. You’re both earthing, you’re also getting a cardiovascular workout and you are building your lung capacity because you’re having to hold your breath when you’re swimming. So it holds then release it, it is called Wim Hof breathing, but with movement. Right. So it’s there’s a lot going on there it’s meditative and it’s strength building. We talked about strength and inflammation reduction. There is a lot Yamba’s vitamin D on your body and there is a time you accidentally taken mineral water, that’s pure mineral water. Okay. Sometimes you accidentally suck in a little bit of the ocean, there’s a lot there.

Clint – Let me finish off my list of your perfect ideal perfect scorecard here. Number eight was patience. You realize that this was a long journey. You didn’t rush and do anything crazy like just stop your methotrexate. You didn’t, you just taper it down. You went and saw the rheumatologist and continue to use blood tests as your guide as to how to taper off the medication. And your patience, as you said, it wasn’t, you know, yeah, I think like a year is about the quickest I’ve ever seen. So two years, you know, that’s like setting a good pace. You know, that’s a good pace and that’s anything quicker than that is fairly uncommon. It just takes a lot of time, you had that knowledge, and you had that patience.

Clint – And then number nine, your visualization of the frameworks that I use inside of the program, we have the two printable guidelines and one is, make it a must is why. What are all the reasons in a big list is why you must improve, whether it be just to hold to be able to hold a cup and not have pain or whether it be to go for a hike up a mountain. You’ve always wanted to do whatever it might be. And then the other thing, the printable guide is the daily affirmations. And this comes back to, you know, the two voices in your head that you mentioned before are the loudest voice is going to be, I can do this one day. I’m going to be coming on the podcast and talking to Clint or is it going to be, oh, I really want to just go out with the girls and have a really big, delicious dinner. And which one’s going to win out? So then you got if we count the bursitis as a six b, you got a pure ten out of ten (Inaudible)

Dianne – Yeah, I think that’s wonderful. Yes, I followed the rules, I did what you said, really. And it’s just I’m so grateful that you did the research in the first place. If you had you not done that, I wouldn’t have a formula to follow. So I’m forever grateful, I really am. I’m sharing it to you could have kept to just yourself but you share it with us all.

Clint – Well, funnily enough, it was the excitement around sharing it and the possibility that I was on to something that was one of my big motivators. You know, I’ll never forget I just got chills up the left side of my body when I thought of this again, it was when I found the research papers that showed that everyone with our R.A. feels pain relief when they do a water fast. After I had had a vomiting and diarrhea experience and felt my symptoms go away, I thought, oh, my God, what is this? What just happened? And then I went and found the papers and it said in this study, people with rheumatoid arthritis, when they stopped eating, their symptoms went away and it was exactly what I’d experience, and I thought it has to be the gut. Yeah, it has to be the gut.

Dianne – Makes sense isn’t. Yeah,

Clint – Yeah, it can’t be anything else. So and it was then that I thought, okay, right, it happens to everyone. So if I can work out how to eat in a way that keeps the pain as low as possible. Then not only will that help me, but there’s something in this to help other people and it was just a big factor. There was just because everyone needs to know this, it was just that kind of like. Yeah, yeah. An.

Clint – Anyway, so thank you very much. You know, I’ve I think I’ve spoken at least or more than you on this episode, and I hope that our audience doesn’t mind too much. But really, it’s about what you’ve achieved and giving you that putting the mirror up and saying, Dianne, you’ve done all these amazing things. You know, and I can see why you have gotten the results that you have, you’ve just done everything 10 out of 10.

Dianne – Well, it sounds like it, but I’ve got the results really, really plays, so yeah. Let’s hope that this inspires some other people to think they can do it. And it’s lovely that you talk and I love listening to you. And I have a million questions I would ask you to offline when I finally get to work again. You know about your journey after two, once you’re off medication.

Clint – I have a lot of information that I’m going to be sharing in upcoming podcasts about the journey afterwards, so stay tuned for some big updates on that. But in one word, what we need to but not one word, but in one phrase, what is most paramount now is avoid complacency. And that is the most crucial message I can convey, and I cannot convey it strongly enough. And my journey since, I gave my TED talk and since 2017 and basically just having our kids and so forth is interesting. So I have a story that’s going to be a really interesting one to share some more lessons that I have personally learned. And it all comes down to complacency and we can never, ever become complacent, so that’s the thing. It’s like the life of Pi, we’re living with this ferocious animal. And whilst we can learn to live with it and we can even get to a point where it can become alongside us and it can be able to you know, it cannot interfere with us and we can learn to live together. The moment we forget that it’s a wild animal and we start to aggravate it by poking at a little bit and irritating it a little bit, that wild animal will go you like never before, just as it was biologically designed to do so. So do not go out and have party nights with the girls, do not go out and start you might be able to reduce your exercise levels. But certainly, I would encourage you to be a fit athletic human now forever, that’s the goal. Remains super fit, just be fit and that’s what we got to aim for fitness.

Dianne – Good, now that’s doable and still wonderful.

Clint – Yeah, I’m pumped up, I’m excited. Yeah. Feels like we’re on a coaching call. Like I feel like this is the vibe. When we do our monthly calls with our support group in Rheumatoid Support, this is energy. It’s like we can, you know, we can do this, this is it. OK, so so that’s how it feels. I always get a buzz us get such a buzz.

Dianne – Yeah. I feel buzz too. I feel euphoria right now

Clint – Well, you’ll join us too. You come on and we’ll set up a special time, like a bonus session with you. I’ll do something as we record this we’re in early December. So we’ll set up something with you in either January or February, depending on your schedule. And we’ll lay out a game plan for how you can tell us. You’ve got those strategies there picturing end goal, the voices in your head, how to control those, the new and better you how to work towards that and I’m just putting words in your mouth you’re the expert. But you’re going to put together a strategy for our support group members and say, this is how you can go from A to B and control your mind and use your mind to be working for you and not against you.

Dianne – Yeah. Wonderful for doing that. Yeah.

Clint – All right. Well, thank you very much. And I really appreciate all that you’ve shared and thanks for coming on the show.

Dianne – Thank you so much, Clint. Thanks for having me.